ONTD Political

A decisive conclusion is necessary

11:33 am - 11/19/2012
A decisive conclusion is necessary
There is no middle path here – either the Gazans and their infrastructure are made to pay the price, or we reoccupy the entire Gaza Strip.

Anyone who thinks Hamas is going to beg for a cease-fire, that Operation Pillar of Defense will draw to a close and quiet will reign in the South because we hit targets in the Gaza Strip, needs to think again.

With the elimination of a murderous terrorist and the destruction of Hamas’s long-range missile stockpile, the operation was off to an auspicious start, but what now? This must not be allowed to end as did Operation Cast Lead: We bomb them, they fire missiles at us, and then a cease-fire, followed by “showers” – namely sporadic missile fire and isolated incidents along the fence. Life under such a rain of death is no life at all, and we cannot allow ourselves to become resigned to it.

A strong opening isn’t enough, you also have to know how to finish – and finish decisively. If it isn’t clear whether the ball crossed the goal-line or not, the goal isn’t decisive. The ball needs to hit the net, visible to all. What does a decisive victory sound like? A Tarzan-like cry that lets the entire jungle know in no uncertain terms just who won, and just who was defeated.

To accomplish this, you need to achieve what the other side can’t bear, can’t live with, and our initial bombing campaign isn’t it.

THE DESIRE to prevent harm to innocent civilians in Gaza will ultimately lead to harming the truly innocent: the residents of southern Israel. The residents of Gaza are not innocent, they elected Hamas. The Gazans aren’t hostages; they chose this freely, and must live with the consequences.

The Gaza Strip functions as a state – it has a government and conducts foreign relations, there are schools, medical facilities, there are armed forces and all the other trappings of statehood. We have no territorial conflict with “Gaza State,” and it is not under Israeli siege – it shares a border with Egypt. Despite this, it fires on our citizens without restraint.

Why do our citizens have to live with rocket fire from Gaza while we fight with our hands tied? Why are the citizens of Gaza immune? If the Syrians were to open fire on our towns, would we not attack Damascus? If the Cubans were to fire at Miami, wouldn’t Havana suffer the consequences? That’s what’s called “deterrence” – if you shoot at me, I’ll shoot at you. There is no justification for the State of Gaza being able to shoot at our towns with impunity. We need to flatten entire neighborhoods in Gaza. Flatten all of Gaza. The Americans didn’t stop with Hiroshima – the Japanese weren’t surrendering fast enough, so they hit Nagasaki, too.

There should be no electricity in Gaza, no gasoline or moving vehicles, nothing. Then they’d really call for a ceasefire.

Were this to happen, the images from Gaza might be unpleasant – but victory would be swift, and the lives of our soldiers and civilians spared.

IF THE government isn’t prepared to go all the way on this, it will mean reoccupying the entire Gaza Strip. Not a few neighborhoods in the suburbs, as with Cast Lead, but the entire Strip, like in Defensive Shield, so that rockets can no longer be fired.

There is no middle path here – either the Gazans and their infrastructure are made to pay the price, or we reoccupy the entire Gaza Strip. Otherwise there will be no decisive victory. And we’re running out of time – we must achieve victory quickly. The Netanyahu government is on a short international leash. Soon the pressure will start – and a million civilians can’t live under fire for long. This needs to end quickly – with a bang, not a whimper.

--

The writer, whom I currently think is evil, is the son of former PM of Israel Ariel Sharon.

He certainly isn't alone in his thinking; according to a HuffPo article: Israel's Deputy Prime Minister Eli Yishai is reported by The Yeshiva World News to have said, "We must blow Gaza back to the Middle Ages, destroying all the infrastructure including roads and water." Haaretz also reports that Yishai stated, "The goal of the operation is to send Gaza back to the Middle Ages."

So far, 73 Palestinians and 3 Israelis have died.
violetrose 19th-Nov-2012 06:46 am (UTC)
So, the ultimate solution to the conflict should be genocide?

Oh, okay then.
beetlebums 19th-Nov-2012 07:35 am (UTC)
Not to sound rude or anything but shouldn't Israel know better than to do that with the world history of Jewish misplacing and liquidation?
violetrose 19th-Nov-2012 07:40 am (UTC)
Idk I feel uncomfortable comparing Israel's policies to the Holocaust, considering the fact that not all Jews agree with what Israel is doing (and would certainly not agree with an attempt at mass genocide and extermination of the Palestinian people). Lumping Israel with all Jewish people is disingenuous at best, and offensive at worst.

I find it can also reinforce the idea that it's 'Jews versus Muslims', or even just 'Jews versus Arabs', despite the fact that there are plenty of Arab and African Jews.
beetlebums 19th-Nov-2012 07:45 am (UTC)
I apologize, I'll be sure to mention government rather than Israel themselves in the future.

I just find a lot of the policies are scary similar to some of the ones used in WWII. The closing them in a small area where they cannot leave and the starvation bs (where theyre allowing x amount of calories per person to be brought in) makes me very uncomfortable.
violetrose 19th-Nov-2012 07:56 am (UTC)
Oh it's okay. I'm not Jewish, which I one of the reasons I'm generally uncomfortable with comparing Israel's policies to the Holocaust. That, and there are plenty of Jews in this community and elsewhere that disagree with Israel's policies and Holocaust comparisons.

I certainly agree that Israel's policies are hugely problematic and that the author of this article is clearly advocating genocide; suggesting that all utilities and food supplies to Gaza should be cut-off to make sure the Palestinian people surrender their right to political and national sovereignty, and the ones that don't want to, well, fuck them, is absolutely genocidal.

However, I would hope Israel does not go to such extreme lengths, and I suspect that if it did, it would lead to international intervention, which could likely to another major world war, and cause extensive casualties on both sides. So not only is it a terrible idea for the fact of it being genocide, it would cause even more destabilisation in the region, and do nothing to solve the conflict.
beetlebums 19th-Nov-2012 08:05 am (UTC)
One big clusterfuck with many shades of grey. How do you get two sides to stop kicking and screaming to actually talk shit out? I want this resolved in my lifetime :(
per_simmon 19th-Nov-2012 02:15 pm (UTC)
I'm Israeli and yes, yes we should. It's completely fucking disgusting.
sfrlz 19th-Nov-2012 03:34 pm (UTC)
I really don't like what's going on right now either but I also really don't like when this comparison gets brought out...
beetlebums 19th-Nov-2012 06:34 pm (UTC)
C/P from a response below

I clarified myself up ahead but I was talking about finding some of Israel government's policies with Gaza to be scary similar to what was happened to the ghettos with in closing them and the calorie limitations.

It may be Goodwin-ish yet I find those comparisons in "official policies" to be uncomfortably scary.
ladypolitik 19th-Nov-2012 05:23 pm (UTC)
Ive always strongly argued, as a general rule of thumb, to never compare atrocities and oppressions or have them 'compete', even concerning topics unrelated to this conflict. Generally, we all possess some form of privilege. For example, just because you can be a victim of homophobia or sexism doesnt mean you're incapable of being racist or transphobic (and all the various oppressor/opposed combos we can think of).

The same reasoning should apply to historical atrocities. Thus, having a link to a historical atrocity or diaspora doesnt mean one is impervious to committing the same or similar crimes against others.

As far as this conflict, it should be good enough to demand, "why would state A (or proponents of state A) condone any allusions to genocide?", rather than whether they should know better.

Because really, from the shittiest ad-hoc theocracies in the world to the most advanced, and given established international laws and human rights regulations, and just basic standards of decency, we should all know better, right?
violetrose 19th-Nov-2012 05:36 pm (UTC)
You articulated my objections to comparing Israel's policies to the Holocaust better than I could.

I think we should all know better and be able to realise that different atrocities all often arise from entirely different circumstances. What's happening in Israel is not the same as what happened in Nazi Germany, and vice versa. Comparing the two is false equivalency at best, and highly offensive at worst.

And frankly, I think this highlights some of the anti-Semitism on the pro-Palestine side; because really, we should know better than to fall into that trap.
ladypolitik 19th-Nov-2012 05:38 pm (UTC)
Indeed, indeed.
beetlebums 19th-Nov-2012 06:32 pm (UTC)
I clarified myself up ahead but I was talking about finding some of Israel government's policies with Gaza to be scary similar to what was happened to the ghettos with in closing them and the calorie limitations.

It may be Goodwin-ish yet I find those comparisons in "official policies" to be uncomfortably scary.
soleiltropiques 19th-Nov-2012 07:55 pm (UTC)
So very well put, to both of you.

"And frankly, I think this highlights some of the anti-Semitism on the pro-Palestine side; because really, we should know better than to fall into that trap".

This is very true. Some are even Holocaust deniers.

Something which also happens at times like this is that moderate voices speaking for peace and justice on both sides tend to be drowned out.

As a side note, I will echo a (francophone) friend of mine and rename (= nickname) Ariel Sharon's son as Mr. 'Charogne'. (For those who don't speak French, this word is a synonym of 'carrion'.) I think it fits this fellow to a T.

(Edited for clarity)


Edited at 2012-11-19 07:56 pm (UTC)
violetrose 19th-Nov-2012 09:45 pm (UTC)
Ugh, I can't with Holocaust deniers. Get off my side. Actually, get off everyone's side and leave us all alone tbh.
moonshaz 19th-Nov-2012 07:40 pm (UTC)
WORD.
sfrlz 20th-Nov-2012 03:34 am (UTC)
This is a much better way of putting it than my usual ASDKLFASHKDF REALLY??

So thank you. lol.
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