ONTD Political

Penn State and Berkeley: A Tale of Two Protests

4:06 am - 11/14/2011
On Wednesday night, two proud universities saw student demonstrations that spiraled into violence. On the campus of Penn State University in State College Pennsylvania, several hundred students rioted in anger after the firing of legendary 84-year-old head football coach Joe Paterno. At the University of California at Berkeley, 1,000 students, part of the Occupy USA movement, attempted to maintain their protest encampment in the face of police orders to clear them out.

At Penn State, students overturned a media truck, hit an ESPN reporter in the head with a rock and made every effort at arson, attempting to set aflame the very heart of their campus. They raised their fists in defense of a man fired for allegedly covering up the actions of a revered assistant who doubled as a serial child rapist. The almost entirely male student mob was given the space by police to seethe and destroy without restraint.

At Berkeley, the police had a much different response. Defenseless students were struck repeatedly with batons, as efforts were made to disperse their occupation by Sproul Hall, the site of the famed Mario Savio–led free speech battles of the 1960s.

Two coasts and two riots: a frat riot and a cop riot. Each riot, an indelible mark of shame on their respective institutions.

The difference is that at Berkeley, the Occupiers—a diverse assemblage of students, linking arms—pushed back and displayed true courage in the face of state violence. They would not be moved. These students are a credit to their school and represent the absolute best of a young generation who are refusing to accept the world as it is.

At Penn State, we saw the worst of this generation: the flotsam and the fools; the dregs and the Droogs; young men of entitlement who rage for the machine.

No matter how many police officers raised their sticks, the students of Berkeley stood their ground, empowered by a deeper set of commitments to economic and social justice.

No matter how many children come forward to testify how Joe Paterno’s dear friend Jerry Sandusky brutally sodomized them on their very campus, the students at Penn State stood their ground. They stood committed to a man whose statue adorns their campus, whose salary exceeds $1.5 million and whose name for years was whispered to them like he was a benevolent Russian czar and they were the burgeoning Black Hundreds.

Theirs was a tragic statement that proud Penn State has become little more than a company town that’s been in the lucrative business of nursing Joe Paterno’s legend for far too long.

I spoke this morning to a student who was at Sproul Hall and another resident who was a bystander at State College. The word that peppered both of their accounts was “fear:” fear that those with the space and means to be violent—the police at Berkeley and the rioters at Penn State—would take it to, as Anne, a Berkeley student said to me, “a frightening point of no return.”

I would argue that this “point of no return” has now actually been reached, spurred by Wednesday night’s study in contrasts.

November 9 was a generational wake-up call to every student on every campus in this country. Which side are you on? Do you defend the ugliest manifestations of unchecked power or do you fight for a better world with an altogether different set of values? Do you stand with the Thugs of Penn State or do you stand with Occupiers of Berkeley? It’s fear vs. hope, and the stakes are a hell of a lot higher than a BCS bowl.

Source: http://www.thenation.com/blog/164535/penn-state-and-berkeley-tale-two-protests
hinoema 14th-Nov-2011 12:46 pm (UTC)
*likes*
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 01:07 pm (UTC)
I find it funny that some of the commentators are crying that the entire student population is being condemned for the riots. They claim that the riots are a small minority of the students. If that's so, what are the other students doing?

Because you think if only a small minority feel this way than the rest of them would at least be counter protesting, or boycotting the game, or doing something a little more proactive for the sake of those young boys who were victimized. Are they really going to condemn us for the -wonderful- impression the rioters are making when that's the biggest response we've been seeing?
chaya 14th-Nov-2011 02:38 pm (UTC)
TBH if I was a Penn State student right now, as a woman, I'd be holed up in my room with the door locked, working on transferring ASAP.

And maybe blogging.
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 03:04 pm (UTC)
I think I would do that too. The riots are pretty scary.
chaya 14th-Nov-2011 03:08 pm (UTC)
Yep. As much as I want to see counter-activism, I can't blame any of the students for not counter-protesting in any confrontational/physical presence way because of how violent these pro-Paterno morons have proven themselves to be. This isn't to say that they should be exempt from any expectations of doing anything - sending money to RAINN and making your voice heard in blogs etc are safer and more logical ways to make your voice heard imo.
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 03:10 pm (UTC)
Indeed.

I also don't think one should be concerned about being "blanketed" because if they show that they are 1) not a rioter and 2) not involved in part of the cover up then we probably aren't going to condemn them just for attending.

Maybe some of the coverage of the riots are sensationalist but my impression is more based off the rioters and the public opinion than just rather "do they attend that university."
lozbabie 14th-Nov-2011 03:01 pm (UTC)
http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/2011/11/11/2555941/penn-state-candlelight-vigil-lavar-arrington-speech

Candelight vigil for the victims

http://www.newsday.com/sports/college/college-football/at-penn-state-hope-rises-out-of-the-blue-1.3317522

'Blue out' to honour the victims at their most recent game

http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/2011/11/11/2554486/penn-state-sandusky-joe-paterno-scandal-fundraiser

Alumn raising money for victims of sexual assault.

I'm an Aussie who does not get grid iron, does not understand how people can be so passionate about college teams. All the information above I gleaned from the threads here at ONTD_P. Five minutes to Google from memories.

There is plenty being done, but the dickheads who rioted and are being all emotional about the coach are more newsworthy, hence are getting more coverage.
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 03:07 pm (UTC)
I'm not surprised the riots are getting more coverage, and I know other things are being done, but I still feel like the riot does condemn the college as well as the scandal. I know it's obvious that not everyone in the college is acting like this, but I think there's enough going on to give the impression that football matters more.

I guess I have a hard time expressing it but I just feel like it's reasonable to condemn this university and the rioters, but other students are acting offended because of it.
lozbabie 14th-Nov-2011 03:09 pm (UTC)
I 100% think it's OK to condemn the uni. They dropped the ball big time and it's only now it's come out, that they're trying to fix it.

And the students I've seen that are offended are the ones who are being told 'All UPenn students are scumbags/rape apologists/ect' I'd be offended at hearing that.
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 03:12 pm (UTC)
I'm not sure if anyone has condemned all of the UPenn students, though. This article itself was more comparing the rioters versus the protestors, and people were getting offended at this article itself, even if they might not have participated in the riot.
bent_ley 14th-Nov-2011 03:19 pm (UTC)
fyi upenn is university of pennslyvania. different school than penn state
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 03:24 pm (UTC)
Ah, thanks.

Looking back my first comment is a little unfair but I am somewhat frustrated at the riots and so many people trying to defend the college. I don't blame all the students of course but I don't feel bad that people are calling out the rioters.
bent_ley 14th-Nov-2011 03:39 pm (UTC)
i dont feel bad that people are calling out the rioters at all. i think a lot of students at penn state are being complete idiots. but i think the coverup here is way more important than the riot. idk
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 03:50 pm (UTC)
Yeah, but I think the coverup is getting a lot of attention too.

I also think it's bullshit that people are acting like Paterno is innocent. Even if he only got a report he went for years knowing that someone under his wing was likely raping children and didn't do a thing to save the boys.
bent_ley 14th-Nov-2011 03:55 pm (UTC)
yep joe has known since at least 98 and is extremely guilty
romp 14th-Nov-2011 07:07 pm (UTC)
Well, the students who are complaining about bring grouping in with the rioters are making it all about them, yeah? Children have been raped but, worse, people think badly of these poor Penn State students!
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 09:14 pm (UTC)
I just feel like it's a non-issue compared to the riot and the child rape scandal, that people may be generalizing the student body and the college administration over the actions they've observed from the student body and the college administration.
muppetfromhell 14th-Nov-2011 04:50 pm (UTC)
Thanks. We've been getting some undeserved flack this week.
mirhanda 14th-Nov-2011 06:36 pm (UTC)
Yeah, especially after that post yesterday with that one, lone guy protesting the game and how the students and alums were hitting him and spitting on him and throwing things at him and knocking his signs down and yelling at him. Doesn't really make the student body look that sypathetic. Not one person went to stand with him.
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 09:11 pm (UTC)
I think it's that and rumors that you could ask around campus about it and the popular opinion is that Joe Paterno shouldn't have been fired.
bent_ley 14th-Nov-2011 03:07 pm (UTC)
okay i really really hate penn state right now and the students support of joepa BUT their candle light vigil on friday had like 5x the amount of students as the riot and the schools newly sponosered RAINN campaign has raised over 300,000 dollars in less than a week.
mariechan 14th-Nov-2011 03:15 pm (UTC)
I heard about that and it's good to see that there's a vigil and fundraising being done. I don't think anyone is condemning all the students but I feel an overwhelming majority of the comments on the article are about how it's so unfair that the college looks bad because of the riots. I also don't think the article means to compare PennU to Berkley, so much as compare Occupy Wallstreet protests to riots over football.
etherealtsuki 14th-Nov-2011 04:16 pm (UTC)
Some were sprayed with mace by the police actually, iirc.
ariante 14th-Nov-2011 06:35 pm (UTC)
So police using mace is okay as long as you disagree with the people they are macing?

Not that I don't think the people protesting Joepa's dismissal aren't scum and deserve some mace to the face.
lizzy_someone 14th-Nov-2011 08:06 pm (UTC)
So police using mace is okay as long as you disagree with the people they are macing?

It's not so much about disagreement as it is about setting things on fire.
dearmisterecho 14th-Nov-2011 01:32 pm (UTC)
A+ article
mollywobbles867 14th-Nov-2011 02:21 pm (UTC)
ALL OF THIS. Yes.
bent_ley 14th-Nov-2011 03:10 pm (UTC)
okay as someone that advocates for victims of sexual abuse and lives in PA, i'm kind of sick of talking about the riot at penn state. college students riot over sports ALL THE TIME.and its ALWAYS fucking stupid. we all know it. instead of focusing attention on that i think we should be focusing our attention of the MASS COVERUP OF CHILD RAPE.
bent_ley 14th-Nov-2011 03:12 pm (UTC)
like there is so so so much press over the riot but why is there not so so so much press about the fact that penn state officials and joepa knew about the abuse in 98 and forced sandusky into retirement?
roseofjuly 14th-Nov-2011 03:20 pm (UTC)
Because we're only able to focus our attention one thing at a time, right?

College students do often riot over sports. The rioting is not always caused by a football coach who looked the other way while a colleague raped children.

Talking about the rioting IS talking about the coverup, because it's indicative of the atmosphere at Penn State that made such a cover-up possible.
bent_ley 14th-Nov-2011 03:38 pm (UTC)
i disagree. acting like this riot is different than any other college sports riot is incorrect. this could be happening at any school where the focus on college sports is so great that their game outcomes could produce riots.

we should be talking about how the penn state football program basically funds everything at the school. we should be talking about how the penn state officials felt the program was more important than children. the riot was important to talk about on wednesday when it happened. now its monday and i think we should be writing articles focusing on the coverup and not the idiot students.
mollywobbles867 14th-Nov-2011 04:15 pm (UTC)
where the focus on college sports is so great that their game outcomes could produce riots.

Yeah, but this wasn't a game outcome. It was a riot over Paterno being fired for not doing a damn thing when he knew children were being raped. It's not that hard to look at the rioters and coming to the conclusion that they believe that football is more important than the coverup.
roseofjuly 14th-Nov-2011 07:51 pm (UTC)
i disagree. acting like this riot is different than any other college sports riot is incorrect. this could be happening at any school where the focus on college sports is so great that their game outcomes could produce riots.

It IS different from other college sports riots. They're not rioting because they lost a game, or because they're trying to change the mascot or something.

It's happening at Penn State, right now, because they fired a football coach who covered up child rape. Let's not obscure details or call them irrelevant simply because college riots can happen for other reasons at other places. That's not the point.

we should be talking about how the penn state officials felt the program was more important than children.

And the entire POINT of the riot was to protest the firing of a man who thought it was more important. The atmosphere at Penn State was that Paterno and football were more important than the welfare of children. The riot REFLECTS that; it doesn't deflect attention away from it, it amplifies it.

the riot was important to talk about on wednesday when it happened. now its monday and i think we should be writing articles focusing on the coverup and not the idiot students.

Internet time has really warped people's perceptions of real time, hasn't it? Wednesday was less than a week ago. The students started a violent riot in which they overturned a news truck and did other stupid things. Why do we have to stop talking about it less than a week later?

The idiot students are part of a culture that promoted the cover-up. Spanier, Schultz, Curley and Paterno thought they could cover this up precisely because it is Penn State country and because they knew that others rated the football team higher on the food chain than the children. This is shocking, and riotous, to the students precisely because this is not what they EXPECTED to happen - they expected it to go away, and maybe Paterno to retire in a ball of glory and Spanier to remain untouched. Don't you see that the issues are related? Things do not happen in a vacuum. The riots at Penn State would not have happened if the cover-up had not happened - but the cover-up would not have happened without the kind of protective atmosphere that also produced the riots.

Besides, like I said, people are capable of thinking about more than one issue at the same time - and about several different facets of the same issue.
cadetsandkings 14th-Nov-2011 03:56 pm (UTC)
I'm just mildly amused that it all kicked off on Nov. 9th, because that was also the day of a big student demo in the UK. Which will probably also achieve the same nothing that last year's NUS and NCAFC demos achieved.

It's depressing. Good on the Berkeley kids.
xvisqueux 14th-Nov-2011 04:29 pm (UTC)
This gave me the chills.
baka_tenshi 14th-Nov-2011 05:07 pm (UTC)
this is a good article and that blog writer should feel good.
etherealtsuki 14th-Nov-2011 05:07 pm (UTC)
While I agree with point of this article because the higher ups of police had an agenda with the Occupy Berkeley, one thought that kept popping in my head that did both protest had nearly the same amount?

When the riot was happened, PSU's local police was ill-equipped to handle a rioting crowd of 2K and the State Riot Police had to come in and end it (and even them weren't all that successful either) because they were skirting a nearby town. There were containing, spraying pepper spray or mace, and arrests though.

Berkeley had a rep of being a protest hotbed and a police that is trained for potential rioting wouldn't be surprising. Plus it's easier to fuck with a crowd that is enforcing non-violent protest than a crowd that riots hard and fast. At least the media at least points out the containing, arrests and spraying mace/pepper spray in a non-violent protest and rightfully so. That stuff in a riot is basically a given, but in a non-violent protest, it shows you the corruption of police.

romp 14th-Nov-2011 07:12 pm (UTC)
There are multiple factors going on but I think it matters that the Berkeley people are seen by many as hippies and free-loaders and a problem while the Penn State students are hard-working young people who may be our bosses one day.
romp 14th-Nov-2011 07:13 pm (UTC)
young men of entitlement who rage for the machine

a frat riot and a cop riot

I like this.
lizzy_someone 14th-Nov-2011 08:09 pm (UTC)
Yo, Alameda County and UCPD, instead of beating up people who are doing nothing more than standing peacefully on a lawn with arms linked, how about you go help contain the protestors who are attempting to commit arson? (Okay, obviously flying across the country is not very practical. But the double standard is outrageous.)
wrestlingdog kind of ot, but I need to rant14th-Nov-2011 10:55 pm (UTC)
This reminds me of a NYT article I read this morning which tried to compare what's going on at Penn State now to the Virginia Tech shooting (in terms of what impact it would have on alumni giving). It made me so fucking mad. THESE TWO EVENTS ARE NOTHING ALIKE. YES, THEY ARE BOTH AWFUL TRAGEDIES. BUT THE DIFFERENCE IS THAT ONE WAS THE VIOLENT ACT OF A SINGLE MAN, AND THE OTHER WAS A SYSTEMATIC COVERUP OF THE RAPE OF YOUNG BOYS.
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