ONTD Political

Romney Dodged the Draft

First he didn't "desire" to serve, but didn’t evade it. Then he "longed" to go. The truth: He got four deferments
By Joan Walsh

Mitt Romney changed his story on poverty in St. Louis Thursday. Where in February, during the GOP primary, he said “I’m not concerned about the very poor,” today he called rising poverty rates “a moral failure” – and blamed it on President Obama. But Romney supports Paul Ryan’s budget, which would slash food stamps, Head Start, Medicaid, nutrition programs for pregnant women and their children, and his tax plan would raise taxes on the poor and working class while giving himself an extra $5 million or so. Mitt, you got it right the first time: You’re not concerned about the very poor.

But Romney’s shifting stories on his Vietnam status could have real political consequences, as an Associated Press expose revealing that he sought and got four deferments from military service during the Vietnam War gets more play. It’s not the deferments that will hurt – Dick Cheney got five. It’s the fact that over the years, Romney has lied about it.

AP politely says his story has “evolved,” but tracks the puzzling changes. Running for president in 2007, Romney told the Boston Globe, “I longed in many respects to actually be in Vietnam and be representing our country there, and in some ways it was frustrating not to feel like I was there as part of the troops that were fighting in Vietnam.”

But in 1994, running against Ted Kennedy for his Massachusetts Senate seat while in his “I’m not a typical Republican” phase, he admitted “it was not my desire to go off and serve in Vietnam.” Fair enough: His father, George Romney, turned against the war, and so did a lot of Republicans (even if party hawks would later try to hang the “loss” of Vietnam on the antiwar left and their Democratic enablers). Indeed, in 1970, at 23, Romney told the Globe, ”If it wasn’t a political blunder to move into Vietnam, I don’t know what is.”

But while telling the truth about his lack of “desire to go off and serve” in 1994, Romney lied again, telling the Boston Herald he didn’t “take any actions to remove myself from the pool of young men who were eligible for the draft.” That’s absolutely not true. He got his first deferment while at Stanford University, where in his prep-school prankster phase he counter-protested a Vietnam draft protest. That’s another lie, in a way: While posing as pro-draft and pro-war, he was evading the draft with an “activity in study” deferment. After his freshman year, he got deferment status as “a minister of religion or divinity student,” which he’d keep while working in France as a missionary for his Mormon church.

Yet the AP reveals that other young Mormons were denied that deferment. And since the church itself strongly supported the war, its leaders eventually limited such deferments, but Romney kept his.

After his religious deferment, he got another academic deferment to finish school. By the time he was draft eligible, troop numbers were declining, and his lottery number was never called.

As Rachel Maddow noted last night, this story got eclipsed by post-Wisconsin coverage, but Romney’s dissembling here, all captured in newspapers in real time, should be a real problem for him. Especially since he’s getting the old George W. Bush band back together and backing the Bush-Cheney neocon foreign policy that never saw a war it didn’t like. His campaign refused to comment on the AP story. Let’s see if Romney has to answer for his Vietnam deceit in the days to come.

I talked about the story on MSNBC’s “Bashir Live” today. As a bonus, you can see me tell Bashir I can’t answer a question, when he asks me why veterans are supporting Romney over Obama 66-34 percent. I started to BS, and then decided to keep a promise to myself that I won’t make things up when I really don’t know the truth. A little cringe-making, but better than faking it.



Source

OP: I apologize if this has already been posted. I searched and couldn't find it, but good lord knows I'm not the most observant person. Let me know if I need more tags.
layweed 16th-Jun-2012 08:38 pm (UTC)
Kinda makes Thinkgeek's weekend special t-shirt all the more laughable then:

I present to you, THE ROMBO! (only not really because I can't do anything but link to the page on TG)
http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts-apparel/unisex/popculture/ef65/

Edited at 2012-06-16 08:40 pm (UTC)
executivehpfan 16th-Jun-2012 09:03 pm (UTC)
Interesting. -crafty hands-
nicosian 16th-Jun-2012 09:11 pm (UTC)
Has this man ever made a consistent, factual statement of anything? if he said it was raining, i'd still go check, even if we were standing outside.

The man's lied/backtracked/misled, on every thing. Its fairly clear he's saying what he thinks whatever group wants to hear.

( I guess I also recall his missionary work wasn't this cold water flat drudgery he sold it to be, at all. An embellishment, again)

baked_goldfish 18th-Jun-2012 06:27 am (UTC)
Has this man ever made a consistent, factual statement of anything?

One of these days we're going to find out he thinks the trees in Michigan are not the right height at all.

Edited at 2012-06-18 06:27 am (UTC)
milleniumrex 16th-Jun-2012 09:19 pm (UTC)
I don't have a problem with people avoiding the draft.

I also don't have a problem with people avoiding the draft while supporting the war.

I do have a problem with Mitt Romney avoiding the draft while supporting the SAME DRAFT.
evewithanapple 16th-Jun-2012 11:03 pm (UTC)
The draft was for poor people, silly! Bonus points if they were black.
sestree 16th-Jun-2012 11:15 pm (UTC)
triple word score if they were functionally illiterate.

*grrrrr*
ceilidh 17th-Jun-2012 07:43 pm (UTC)
certainly not for rich dudes at Stanford, oh noes.
romp 16th-Jun-2012 11:12 pm (UTC)
exactly
pamuya 17th-Jun-2012 12:12 am (UTC)
iawtc
thecityofdis 17th-Jun-2012 12:53 am (UTC)
I also don't have a problem with people avoiding the draft while supporting the war.

can you explain this part to me? asking sincerely: it seems counterintuitive, so i'd like to understand.
anolinde 17th-Jun-2012 01:09 am (UTC)
Not the OP, but I would sure as hell never want to fight in a war even if I supported the cause.
milleniumrex 17th-Jun-2012 01:10 am (UTC)
I strongly oppose the draft. I believe it's a fatally flawed system, and usually incredibly classist. I don't want anyone to be drafted, and I think the all-volunteer military is the best thing to happen to this country in a long time, and I wish Israel would follow suit (although universal service is a bit different than a lottery draft).

As such, whether I believe a war is necessary or not doesn't really have much bearing on my feelings on the draft.
aubade_saudade 16th-Jun-2012 09:20 pm (UTC)
Republicans are stans and Romney knows it. He lies and evades and flip flops and laughs when confronted with past fuckery, and he doesn't worry about it because their illogical loyalty to white rich man trumps all. They learn about this and fox is like, 4 deferments? Yr faves could never
erunamiryene 16th-Jun-2012 10:40 pm (UTC)
I have zero fucking patience for fucking rich white fuckheads who sit on their fucking pampered asses and send the rest of us poor kids off to fight their fucking wars for money and then wring their hands about BUT OH POOR ME I REALLY WANTED TO GO I SWEAR.

"I wanted to go," my fucking pasty white ass, Romney. IF YOU'D WANTED TO, YOU COULD HAVE VOLUNTEERED. NO ONE WAS STOPPING YOU FROM ENLISTING. But no, you sat on your fucking ass at school, and then in FRANCE, and are now trying to say that oh my god i feel so bad I didn't go.

You know what? My grandpa says the same thing about World War II, because he couldn't go. But he got a 4F because he got hit in the flu epidemic that hit right after he was born. So, you know, HE ACTUALLY COULDN'T GO. He watched his brothers and his friends sign up and do their duty to their country, and it bothers him to this day (he's 94) that he couldn't serve. Do not even ATTEMPT to fucking put your goddamn pissy-ass, out of touch, Richie Rich, spoiled bratty bullying piece of shit self in the same fucking company as my grandfather, because you're not fucking fit to shine his goddamn shoes.
girlglowstoxic 17th-Jun-2012 01:50 am (UTC)
Well said.
sassalicious 17th-Jun-2012 06:01 am (UTC)
Agree so hard. My grandpa did 2 or 3 tours in Vietnam as a USMC major.
pennylane101 17th-Jun-2012 08:01 am (UTC)
this.
tabaqui 17th-Jun-2012 05:14 pm (UTC)
THIS this this.
redstar826 16th-Jun-2012 11:25 pm (UTC)
on the one hand, I don't blame anyone for not wanting to fight in Vietnam. On the other hand, Mittens. So, meh.
moonshaz 17th-Jun-2012 12:07 am (UTC)
I absolutely don't have a problem with anyone not wanting to fight in Vietnam because of their opposition to the war. A lot of people were strongly against the war on very solid grounds (most of the history books now agree that we shouldn't have gotten involved in the first place, so...)

What I have a problem with is someone claiming he supported the war and the draft wholeheartly while at the same time taking every deferment he could get his hands on to avoid going and then later saying, "Baaawwwww, I SO wish I could have gone, waaaaahhhhh."

The first would be an example of moral integrity. The second would be an example of flaming ginormous hypocrisy. And that = Mittens.
13chapters 17th-Jun-2012 05:28 am (UTC)
This. My dad was actually drafted, and he worked his butt off to get conscientious objector status so he could legally and ethically avoid fighting in a war he didn't believe in.

Get a spine, Romney.
lafinjack 17th-Jun-2012 12:40 am (UTC)
Why do you have mittens only on your other hand?
christoph 17th-Jun-2012 03:07 am (UTC)
lmfao
cher_arlequin 17th-Jun-2012 12:33 am (UTC)
I love how so many Republicans seem to have been draft dodgers. I can't blame anyone for not wanting to fight in Vietnam, but if you are pro-draft you'd better have something to show for it.
kyra_neko_rei 17th-Jun-2012 12:51 am (UTC)
The only people who really have any business supporting a draft are those already in the military, those in the process of joining the military voluntarily, and those who are willing to keep themselves fully eligible and eat that risk if it comes knocking at their door.

And honestly, if someone thinks fighting in a war is that important, they would accomplish much more in terms of getting people enlisted if they instead did the full patriotic song-and-dance routine of some serious balls-to-the-wall military-and-veterans-support activities. If somebody's always putting together care packages to send overseas, or collecting donations for something, or coordinating projects for schoolkids to write letters to soldiers, or driving veterans to and from VA appointments, then they can support the draft all they want. In anyone sitting on their safe ass and a couple deferments, it's the mark of an asshole. Anyone who supports the draft and doesn't want to be that asshole? Start being the kind of selfless, patriotic home-front supporter that people want to join up to make them proud.
kyra_neko_rei 17th-Jun-2012 12:39 am (UTC)
I read some scifi story once wherein declaring war could only be done by popular referendum with open (non-secret) ballot, and a vote for war was also an agreement to sign up for military service then and there.

Instead we've got wars declared by rich people, while the military is made up disproportionately of the poor. And if we don't have a running draft at present (people are registered, but names are not being called), we do have a system with high poverty, high unemployment, and high student loans, which taints the opportunity of military service with being an antidote to a poison supplied by the same source.

Mitt Romney was a rich kid privileged to be able to sit out of the war. He was a hypocrite who financed his support for the war with other people's blood. And he was a selfish shithole who actively supported a draft system which forced other people into a major death risk from which he had arranged his own safety. The first means he's out of touch; the second indicates he's less than fair; the third suggests an ethical bankruptcy that is utterly incompatible with the responsibilities of the office for which he's running.
grace_om 17th-Jun-2012 02:47 am (UTC)
*Applauds comment*
christoph 17th-Jun-2012 03:09 am (UTC)
Do you remember the name of the story by chance? I'm interested in reading it.
kyra_neko_rei 17th-Jun-2012 03:26 am (UTC)
It's For Us, The Living by Robert A Heinlein prior to his libertarian turn. Mostly a long description of a conceptual socialist utopia with discussion of how it arose, with a side of plot. Which is: a 1930s man has a car accident, dies, and wakes up a few centuries later (I can't remember the details), and has various mishaps and experiences getting to know the future.

The society and its origins are very interesting as it involved a removal from power of the financial industry which is relevant to the current problems with the economy, and also the complete reversal of our celeb-obsessed, little-privacy culture now. Lots of discussion of how an economy works that's not dependent on poverty as a goad to get all the necessary work done.

IIRC, it was not published until recently, long after a whole host of Exceptional Libertarian Man (or Woman) stories which he's better known for, though this book has still got hints of Exceptional Man and the sexism of the time in which it was written.
christoph 17th-Jun-2012 03:34 am (UTC)
that sounds like an interesting read, thank you!
celtic_thistle 17th-Jun-2012 03:44 am (UTC)
Seconded.
lafinjack 17th-Jun-2012 12:40 am (UTC)
ladypolitik 17th-Jun-2012 12:57 am (UTC)
Of course he did.
little_rachael 17th-Jun-2012 01:29 am (UTC)
I can't blame anyone for dodging a draft. I would probably do the same thing.

But he's still a sleaze for lying about it several times.
kyra_neko_rei 17th-Jun-2012 03:12 am (UTC)
To say nothing of supporting the draft while making himself exempt from it.

Avoiding something so deeply unpleasant as being forced into military service, exile from one's family, and probable death: completely reasonable, full steam ahead. Doing so while actively campaigning to get other people trapped into doing exactly that? Grade-A choice select asshole.
little_rachael 17th-Jun-2012 07:30 am (UTC)
I agree!
post_position 17th-Jun-2012 01:33 am (UTC)
This is not surprising.
mdemvizi 17th-Jun-2012 02:51 am (UTC)
I am in the 'I don't blame him camp' but I realyl dislike when the Republicans continue to chastise Obama for not serving in the Armed Forces but lying about their own service. Stop it.

I have a lot of issues with the military and if there ever is a forced draft I would freak the fuck out.
sassalicious 17th-Jun-2012 06:08 am (UTC)
How can they hate on him for that? Plenty of people don't serve and it's not like he was old enough to be drafted....
kyra_neko_rei 17th-Jun-2012 03:28 am (UTC)
So he sat there safe and championed a system that chose other people by lottery to force them to fight and risk death.

Why is my brain coming up with Hunger Games analogies?
poetic_pixie_13 17th-Jun-2012 04:49 am (UTC)
“I longed in many respects to actually be in Vietnam and be representing our country there, and in some ways it was frustrating not to feel like I was there as part of the troops that were fighting in Vietnam.”

hinoema 17th-Jun-2012 09:52 am (UTC)
Just had to say the comments in this thread are made of awesome.
rjdaae 17th-Jun-2012 03:39 pm (UTC)
I don't have a problem with draft dodgers; I do have a problem with hypocrites.
tabaqui 17th-Jun-2012 05:17 pm (UTC)
Fuck him and the gold-plated, diamond-studded horse he fled the country on. Jayzus fuck.
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