ONTD Political

Russell Brand vs Peter Hitchens on drugs.

5:12 pm - 08/11/2012


Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsMU77TwYM0

OP: That's on the subject of drugs, not that Peter Hitchens is on drugs of course. But its an example of the Daily Fail's attitude towards drugs as well as the joy of seeing Peter Hitchens recoil at Russell Brand's stated desire to give him a big kiss.
ladypolitik 11th-Aug-2012 09:35 pm (UTC)
Because Im too lazy to google:


Is this Hitchens related to the late one? Because whoa, do they look and even sound awfully alike.
ladypolitik 11th-Aug-2012 09:37 pm (UTC)
I un-lazy'd to confirm my own question.


Man, the dinner table discussions must of been uproarious at the Hitchens household, huh?
bonoffee 11th-Aug-2012 09:43 pm (UTC)
Yes, and I don't think they were that close. How surprising, really! I'm still amazed they were related just because Christopher was a great orator and Peter is a nyaff.
bex 11th-Aug-2012 09:39 pm (UTC)
Team No One.
bonoffee 11th-Aug-2012 09:46 pm (UTC)
Contender for worst sentence in the English language: "And now we're joined by Peter Hitchens". The man has no clue how to actually talk to anyone and listen to other arguments. Russell Brand might be many things, but he isn't without intelligence and reason as Hitchens kept suggesting, having apparently not paid any attention to what Brand was actually saying. He just kept having a go at him for daring to be on a news programme.
snarksnarklaugh 12th-Aug-2012 10:04 pm (UTC)
It shouldn't take 3 years to ween someone off any drug.JFC what are those people doing? That sounds incompetent as all hell.
devour_theflesh 11th-Aug-2012 10:24 pm (UTC)
Well it's interesting when Russell Brand is the reasonable person on the panel.
shadwrayvn 11th-Aug-2012 10:35 pm (UTC)
Yes having & taking drugs is a crime but addiction is a disease & addicts to deserve to be treat humanely. The US sends so many people to jail on drug charges but do nothing to rehabilitate prisoners whether they be addicts or not & what changes when they get out? How many stay clean or get a chance a new noncriminal life?
bex 11th-Aug-2012 11:05 pm (UTC)
Very little. Many prisoners return to shitty situations - they can't get jobs, they may not be able to count on family members for support, and the conditions of their post-incarceration supervision usually demand that they cut ties with any friends who are criminal offenders, which ultimately isolates the returning prisoners just when they need the most support. Conditions of parole can also interfere with them getting jobs, as many re-entering offenders are required to attend treatment or therapy meetings, have their urine tested for drugs and meet with their parole officers as often as once a week. These appointments often take place during business hours and employers are rarely flexible - I've spoken to many women who have lost jobs because of their parole requirements or, conversely, violated their parole because they could not keep up with the requirements while also trying to hold down jobs and pay their bills.

This situation is EXTREMELY stressful, and stress is a powerful trigger for substance use. So you have a person who's trying (maybe) to get clean and will be sent back to jail if he/she is found to be using drugs, and you drop them in a situation of extreme stress with very, very little social support. And then people are fucking surprised when the person relapses.
shadwrayvn 11th-Aug-2012 11:14 pm (UTC)
I know I worked at a rehab center & many were court ordered & it was heart breaking. So many frequent fliers as the staff called them. It breaks my heart & jesus watching them go through withdrawals was honestly one of the most terrifying & heartbreaking thing I have seen in the 10yrs I have been a CNA! Addicts need more support & care.
aubade_saudade 11th-Aug-2012 11:27 pm (UTC)
A lot of different things can work for different people, but I think we should eliminate the concept of the addict as a criminal. A lot of people get those consequences outside of rehab centers and that's why they go to rehab. Because they want to avoid those consequences you found in jail. Maybe you just needed a harsher environment for it to work for you, but a lot of people die when they leave drugs cold turkey and again, the criminalization of addiction is so fucked up imo, so--

idk. I'd hardly think of jail as a good treatment for most people.
violetrose 11th-Aug-2012 11:50 pm (UTC)
Thank you, and well said.

The way we treat addiction, and even minor criminals is ridiculous. So many politicians want to look 'tough' on crime, they completely ignore tha human side of it; from the victims, and offenders perspectives.

Obviously, if you steal, you should receive some form of punishment/consequences for your actions. However, I've known people who've stolen and many did because they were a) on drugs and wanting to feed their addiction, or b) poor as shit and just wanted to eat or have clothes for the kids. My dad always tells me how he and my mother stole my baby clothes when I was born, because they couldn't afford them. And in experience, situations like these are why many people steal or become do drugs; poverty, desperation and a lack of resources.

I'm not trying to suggest these are the only reasons people become addicted or steal, but if we want to address and stop crime in any meaningful way, we need to look at why people commit crimes in the first place, rather than just condemning all criminals, addicts in particular, as worthless.
romp 12th-Aug-2012 03:16 am (UTC)
?! Hitchens doesn't have sympathy for drug addicts because they're breaking the law. So if we dropped the laws and moved to harm reduction, he'd be all for helping people?

That poor Hitchens bastard believes that we'd have no drug addiction if the laws were *more* severe? How does he explain the US? Spend that money on support for parents and children and get rid of the abuse and neglect that comes before the addictions.
snarksnarklaugh 12th-Aug-2012 10:21 pm (UTC)
Money doesn't make parents less neglectful. Foster system is not a good solution. Drug addicts should be sterilized. The U.S. treats it's drug addicts in varying ways because no one way always works. Some people need jail, some need a couple weeks at a recovery program, some need AA, some people overdose and quit. I think there would be more dead addicts if prison gets take out of the equation. Just like drunk drivers. First offense the judge usually sides with leniency unless someone died.
http://www.bop.gov/news/research_projects/published_reports/recidivism/orepramjalcd.pdf
romp 12th-Aug-2012 10:26 pm (UTC)
I don't agree. I think much addiction is actually self-medication and if people had the resources to chose another option, they would. Also, take away the abuse and neglect many street-level addicts experience as children and you'll have fewer people needing to self-medicate as adults.

Edited at 2012-08-12 10:28 pm (UTC)
snarksnarklaugh 14th-Aug-2012 12:19 am (UTC)
I think a lot of people self medicate with things other then drugs though. I don't like calling addiction a disease because it's a genetic part for some, environmental influenced, and/or a personality issue. I agree many of them experience abuse and neglect but so do others and they still make different choices of the choices available. Some people need a hug and cognitive behavioral therapy some people need to be smacked with a big stick called the law to get to therapy.
violetrose 12th-Aug-2012 10:36 pm (UTC)
Drug addicts should be sterilized.

I see.
snarksnarklaugh 14th-Aug-2012 12:31 am (UTC)
There's a serious correlation/causation when addiction is at least for some genetic predisposition. The children of drug addicts are often abused and neglected. And having children may give them a reason to get off drugs in for some but it could also stress them so much they relapse later (if they wouldn't relapse anyway).
mingemonster 12th-Aug-2012 08:56 am (UTC)
Peter Hitchens has the most punchable face/voice. No idea who he is, but "Mail on sunday" popping up under his name made so much sense
ghost_busting 12th-Aug-2012 01:37 pm (UTC)
Got through 3 minutes of that before getting too frustrated by Hitchens to continue.

Say what you like Peter, but Russell Brand knows his shit. Why is he on Newsnight? Why the fuck are you on Newsnight?! Because you regularly like to spew your bigoted bullshit in a newspaper? He has no intelligent or informed response to what anyone is saying so he just goes off on a rightwing rage tangent.
cyranothe2nd 12th-Aug-2012 09:21 pm (UTC)
Peter Hitchens is so gross.
snarksnarklaugh 12th-Aug-2012 10:24 pm (UTC)
Russel Brand is a wanker. Don't listen to drug addicts talk about drugs. They lose all objectivity and in my opinion a lot of credibility.
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